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"I’m not your enemy. Don’t sit here and portray that Puff took something from y’all." - Diddy to The Lox in 2005
Add G Dep to the long list of disgruntled former Bad Boy employees. Errol Louis of the Daily News sat down with him last week a couple of days after he left Rikers Island following a 23 day stay for smashing a cell phone during an argument with a T-Mobile salesman.
Dep signed a contract to create five albums for Diddy’s Bad Boy record label for $350,000 — what seemed like a princely sum at the time. Dep’s first album, "Child of the Ghetto," came out in 2001 and did respectably.
But industry experts say it takes about two years, on average, to create and launch a new album, partly because the creative process can’t be rushed and partly because an artist’s sales slump when radio stations and fans get flooded with too many albums to choose from.
Dep’s five-album deal, in reality, was more like a 10-year employment contract — the equivalent of making $35,000 a year working for somebody else. Actually, it’s worse than that, because the money’s gone now — but any new music Dep wants to record will belong to the label.
Is Puff just doing what he’s supposed do as the head of a label, or is he taking unfair advantage of these young artists? Were all of these people really that gullible and ignorant of the ways of the music business, or is something else going on here? During the whole Lox publishing conflict, he basically said that it wasn’t his fault that they didn’t do their homework. Which is a good point. But don’t these seasoned execs, many of who pulled themselves up from the same streets where they found these rappers, have a moral responsibility to do right by them?
Maybe I’m on a spaceship.
This entry was posted by eskay on Sunday, February 18th, 2007 at 6:48 pm and is filed under Miscellaneous, News. You can follow any responses to this entry through the RSS 2.0 feed. You can leave a response, or trackback from your own site.
February 18th, 2007 at 6:48 pm
Fif!
February 18th, 2007 at 6:52 pm
naw you’re not on a spaceship.
capitalism has a way of exploiting the ignorant, and diddy is proving that it doesn’t matter what color “the man’s” skin is, the less privledged will be taken advantage of in this country.
it’s too bad that artists cant make music for the enjoyment, instead they have to put out albums to fill their quota so they can go try a different label.
February 18th, 2007 at 6:52 pm
how can anyone be surprised by puff’s greed? I think he offered each band member on making the band somethin like $0.30. at this point, anyone that signs with badboy is an asshole.
February 18th, 2007 at 6:53 pm
“and diddy is proving that it doesn’t matter what color “the man’s†skin is, the less privledged will be taken advantage of in this country.”
my next paper is based on that. minus diddy. you get raped if your broke no matter what you are.
February 18th, 2007 at 6:53 pm
http://www.sendspace.com/file/g03u2c
new bone thugs feat. jodeci
smh
February 18th, 2007 at 7:01 pm
smh @ puffy
February 18th, 2007 at 7:03 pm
who am I kidding, I’d be raping niggas too if I was in that position. Any young bloggers out there wanna sign to Nah Right? I’ll get you that new Civic.
February 18th, 2007 at 7:07 pm
Damn he couldn’t come up with $750. I would love to read one of puff’s contracts. You cant blame everything on Diddy, but damn i thought he would at least look out for brothers. I bet biggie had a fucked up contract too.
February 18th, 2007 at 7:08 pm
“I’ll get you that new Civic.”
I’m sayin, I want a jeep B. Tired of flying coach.
February 18th, 2007 at 7:09 pm
was it ever known what kind of raping puff was doin to bigg?
February 18th, 2007 at 7:09 pm
>> who am I kidding, I’d be raping niggas too if I was in that position.
ayoo. twice. and i may not know where you live… but these are hood dudes, they be in Yonkas with or without deals
img265.imageshack.us/img265/6495/newestsig2crcd5.jpg
^one of them double door joints
February 18th, 2007 at 7:11 pm
Child of the Ghetto > 95% of all hip hop albums released after
February 18th, 2007 at 7:21 pm
^oh yeah? never heard it. I saw Billz raving about it on here the other day though.
February 18th, 2007 at 7:22 pm
yes eskay u are on a spaceship,
its funny how u and other rappers dissect and ridicule black executs. for managing and controlling there profit line to the best of there ability but white executs. ( tommy motola, lyon cohens, jimmy ivone, and the owner of j records) never get any bad publicity for running the same business practices, rappers singers country singers all get the same treatment, but when puffy or a jayz or master p or baby does the same practices they are crooks?? prince had to write slave on his face because jews were taken advantage of him and everyone called prince crazy but nothing said to the label..
people forget that record companies sign numerous acts for 6 figure deals that never see the light of the day, so how is the record company protected by artist who never cut it?
they make some good deals and some bad, but dont knock a company for offering some1 with out a high school diploma or any marketable job skills or trade a 6 figure deal for hopefully future earnings.
February 18th, 2007 at 7:23 pm
skinnykennyp Says:
February 18th, 2007 at 7:11 pm
Child of the Ghetto > 95% of all hip hop albums released after
i agree on that ” opportunity knocked and i missed it, to busy in the park getting lift it”
February 18th, 2007 at 7:26 pm
Child of the Ghetto > 95% of all hip hop albums released after
^^guess your only listening to 5% of Hip-Hop
February 18th, 2007 at 7:27 pm
http://www.sendspace.com/file/hwoxz1
^ grafh feat. prinz - put a hole in em
February 18th, 2007 at 7:28 pm
>>its funny how u and other rappers dissect and ridicule black executs.
I posed a question, show me where I’m ‘dissecting’ anything in that post. And how the fuck you sound saying white execs get a pass. Like I’ve never criticized Iovine or Lyor right? The term Tall Israeli’s is a compliment I guess.
February 18th, 2007 at 7:28 pm
i remember i had a doo wop mixtape from way fuckin back, it had a g. dep freestyle that was off the fuckin hook. i would kill to be able to get at my old collection.
February 18th, 2007 at 7:29 pm
diddy is heartless. Only if the lox, g-dep, black rob…etc knew then. He’s seen in a different light cuz he’s black and you’d think he’d do his best to help his own people, but he’s just as bad as the rest. It’s a shame.
February 18th, 2007 at 7:32 pm
eskay Says:
February 18th, 2007 at 7:28 pm
>>its funny how u and other rappers dissect and ridicule black executs.
I posed a question, show me where I’m ‘dissecting’ anything in that post. And how the fuck you sound saying white execs get a pass. Like I’ve never criticized Iovine or Lyor right? The term Tall Israeli’s is a compliment I guess.
But don’t these seasoned execs, many of who pulled themselves up from the same streets where they found these rappers, have a moral responsibility to do right by them?
Maybe I’m on a spaceship.
black people are the only people in the business world who feel if im black and u black u should take care of me and do me right” i am a black man and i c it everyday where i work in the work place. A true business man is focused on his bottom line and profit, not the status of a whole race if he was he would be mlk or ghandi or nelson mendela not a entrep. or business man
February 18th, 2007 at 7:36 pm
G7 Says:
February 18th, 2007 at 7:29 pm
diddy is heartless. Only if the lox, g-dep, black rob…etc knew then. He’s seen in a different light cuz he’s black and you’d think he’d do his best to help his own people, but he’s just as bad as the rest. It’s a shame.
as is most business man.. the heartless part…its take no mercy, nothing is nice in business. most people get fucked on there first deal and then they understand what happend and reup on the 2nd deal…alot of these cats are also bad with money, trying to live in the light and then when the money is gone and then they want to blame diddy or who ever…ok what happened to your show or concert money??
February 18th, 2007 at 7:38 pm
>>A true business man is focused on his bottom line and profit, not the status of a whole race if he was he would be mlk or ghandi or nelson mendela not a entrep. or business man
I’m not saying that he shouldn’t be. However there’s a difference between looking out for your bottom line and raping niggas in the ass no homo.
February 18th, 2007 at 7:41 pm
How come other black execs can run successful businesses without nearly every artist they’ve ever dealt with saying they got fucked? you’re gonna tell me that Diddy is just minding his own business and “looking out for his bottom” line and all these people are being unfair? GTFOH.
February 18th, 2007 at 7:45 pm
eskay Says:
February 18th, 2007 at 7:41 pm
How come other black execs can run successful businesses without nearly every artist they’ve ever dealt with saying they got fucked? you’re gonna tell me that Diddy is just minding his own business and “looking out for his bottom†line and all these people are being unfair? GTFOH.
ok how come once these so called artist leave bad boy and free of “devil diddy” they never have the same success never
mase, craig mack, total, 112, g dep, loon, faith and the warlocks aka lox ??
February 18th, 2007 at 7:48 pm
eskay Says:
February 18th, 2007 at 7:41 pm
How come other black execs can run successful businesses without nearly every artist they’ve ever dealt with saying they got fucked?
all of cash money artist said they got raped, no limit artis all said they got raped also, so did suave house and artist from rap a lot, the only label that never had any disgruntle artist (minus the pink panther) is roc a fella, but thats also because they really only had one succesful artist who happend to be part owner, kanye did not come on the scene till the end, but diddy had numerous of plat. acts as well as cash money and no limit. Its the same as employees @ work who feel they are doing the real work while the managers and ceo makes all the money, but its also the ceo who will lose everything if the company goes over and the employees will just send there resume to another company
February 18th, 2007 at 7:58 pm
>>ok how come once these so called artist leave bad boy and free of “devil diddy†they never have the same success never
^irrelevant
>>the only label that never had any disgruntle artist (minus the pink panther) is roc a fella
^really? the only label huh? ok, gotcha. so everybody is a bonehead and everything Puff does falls under accepted business practices right? you say nothing is nice in business, which we all know, but you act like that makes it right. you don’t see me and my white boss running around talking about we’re family and talking about “Nah Right forever”
February 18th, 2007 at 8:00 pm
yo wait. i mean i understand, yeah diddy is jerking these niggas, but how can you fault him, if these dumbasses will come to the table with no proper representation, no one being like “yo dog, this shit don’t look right”… i mean did G Dep honestly think he could blow $350K and everything would be good?
at the end of the day, all these niggas want to talk like they are men, but they don’t man up when it’s time for business to be conducted?
i like how styles and jada said yo its our fault too, we put out john hancocks on the paper. that’s real talk. it aint right, what diddy is doing, but a smart nigga would know that before signing the contract.
February 18th, 2007 at 8:01 pm
eskay Says:
ou say nothing is nice in business, which we all know, but you act like that makes it right. you don’t see me and my white boss running around talking about we’re family and talking about “Nah Right foreverâ€
yn is not white :)
February 18th, 2007 at 8:02 pm
$350,000 aint small money, you have invest, save, and invest some more. You wont be hearing alot more stories like these because Rappers nowadays have learned from the mistakes of dudes like G Dep, CanIBus, etc. Now, as soon as a Rapper gets a deal ($350,000) he starts a company or several companies with that money (Clothing Company, Jewelery Store etc.) Look at Paul Wall, Jim Jones (I don’t listen to both, but they do grind hard) Rappers have to grind with that Advance Money don’t just spend it, that might be the last $350,000 someone gives you. Man, I could turn $350,000 into some real cake easy, all legal.
February 18th, 2007 at 8:04 pm
eskay Says:
February 18th, 2007 at 7:58 pm
>>ok how come once these so called artist leave bad boy and free of “devil diddy†they never have the same success never
^irrelevant
far from it…it means when they were with puff atleast they were plat. and they could atleast make show money but now every single 1 of them from the bad boy era r bums now that they left…
February 18th, 2007 at 8:05 pm
>> $350,000 aint small money, you have invest, save, and invest some more.
this is G Dep we’re speaking of.
February 18th, 2007 at 8:05 pm
i hope the simpsons movie will be good and not ruin the franchise
February 18th, 2007 at 8:06 pm
u know them niggas wastin that advance money, think how many niggas waste tax refunds every single year!!!!!
February 18th, 2007 at 8:07 pm
@Antski: Jim Jones and Paul Wall ain’t good examples of grinding off your label advance though - both them niggas already had side shit. Jim Jones got a desk job! And Paul been doing the grills.
February 18th, 2007 at 8:08 pm
black people are the only people in the business world who feel if im black and u black u should take care of me and do me right†i am a black man and i c it everyday where i work in the work place. A true business man is focused on his bottom line and profit, not the status of a whole race if he was he would be mlk or ghandi or nelson mendela not a entrep. or business man
^And it’s havin’ this mentality is why we don’t exceed beyond the levels we’re at now. This is why Jews, Italians, etc. have neighborhoods with their own restaurants, grocery stores, clinics, schools, etc. because they have learned to FAIRLY compensate their poople. A dollar in a Jewish business touches 8 to 12 hands in the family before it leaves the community. Does that mean there are no grimey people in other races and cultures? Of course not. Thieving people in all races and social classes. But when you’re a minority you’re held to a higher standard because you’re involved in a business that’s already sheisty enough as it is towards our people. That last thing we need is to have our OWN treat us in that manner. Unfortunately, we are expcected, as Blacks, to be treated unfair by many execs of certain business based merely on skin color alone. Therefore we seek redemption in someone who looks like us and come from the same background because we feel they should UNDERSTAND our situation compared to other execs. Yes, we all realize that “business is business”. But, number one, that term was coined by sheisty execs of corportate Amerikkka who DO look for out their own, but would also low-ball (pause) you in a heartbeat. Two… no one said that doing business had to be BAD business, just practical. Sure, P. Diddy might not be as rich as he is now had he not had such shady contracts. But think of the loyalty and amount of hit records he STILL could’ve produced had he not been such a paper work gangsta. Imagine if the roster still looked like this:
Biggie (had it not been for his untimely death)
Faith
Total
G. Dep
Black Rob
The Hit Men (production team)
The Lox
Carl Thomas
Ma$e
Craig Mack (eh, not so much)
Shyne (in jail, but still would rather sign elsewhere)
112
Damn near every artist on that list has left because of contractual disagreements. And you want me to sit here and believe that it’s just because he’s Black that Black artists are making complaints? Diddy’s greed is obvious, and he attempts to follow behind his corporate counterparts in the industry no matter the cost.
February 18th, 2007 at 8:10 pm
How come other black execs can run successful businesses without nearly every artist they’ve ever dealt with saying they got fucked?
^The other point I missed. Because I’ve never heard of any serious backlash about L.A. Reid, Andre Harrell, or even Jermaine Dupree who doubles as an artist a la Diddy.
February 18th, 2007 at 8:11 pm
http://www.sendspace.com/file/wtg3r5
^ grafh - we the gang
February 18th, 2007 at 8:11 pm
skinnykennyp Says:
February 18th, 2007 at 8:05 pm
i hope the simpsons movie will be good and not ruin the franchise
blank stare
February 18th, 2007 at 8:12 pm
>>far from it…it means when they were with puff atleast they were plat.
no, actually they weren’t.
February 18th, 2007 at 8:12 pm
and what Billz said.
February 18th, 2007 at 8:13 pm
nation = thunder theif
February 18th, 2007 at 8:14 pm
D. Billz Says:
February 18th, 2007 at 8:10 pm
How come other black execs can run successful businesses without nearly every artist they’ve ever dealt with saying they got fucked?
^The other point I missed. Because I’ve never heard of any serious backlash about L.A. Reid, Andre Harrell, or even Jermaine Dupree who doubles as an artist a la Diddy.
j d only had kids as artist thats it, la reid did have beef with artist and baby face thats why laface split up they co owned it 2gether, andre harrell lost his label because he did not run it properly (uptown records) and then he ended up back working for his intern..diddy
February 18th, 2007 at 8:15 pm
true, y’all, Diddy might be catching the most flack… but it always seems easier for niggas to jump on the bandwagon when it’s runnin’. if the lox and all these other niggas wouldnt have had their campaigns and whatnot, would g dep even be coming out? why he didn’t say shit when he first got signed? why are we just hearing about this in 2007?
February 18th, 2007 at 8:15 pm
>> nation = thunder theif
are you ever gonna check your email, or at least learn how to spell. doesn’t firefox come with a built in spell-checker
February 18th, 2007 at 8:15 pm
>>ok how come once these so called artist leave bad boy and free of “devil diddy†they never have the same success never
^Because Diddy is a BRAND. You’re gonna get more chicks in a Bentley than in a Honda Accord, but one an Accord is more practical to the average citizen than a Bentley. Can’t afford the gas, maintenance, or insurance. And that’s basically how Bad Boy is operated. Sure, you’ll definitely get the exposure you need. But, you’re assed out on everything else.
February 18th, 2007 at 8:16 pm
eskay Says:
February 18th, 2007 at 8:12 pm
>>far from it…it means when they were with puff atleast they were plat.
no, actually they weren’t.
let u tell it, each artist went plat. except for g dep, even black rob saw show money off of whoa and reached plat. status.
the same argument goes to when the ceo of bet sold the company to viacom and people said he sold out, it proves who never atteneded a college course in business or management, the goal is to start a company raise value then sell it for a huge profit and move on thats it nothing more or less…….c motown
February 18th, 2007 at 8:17 pm
true, y’all, Diddy might be catching the most flack… but it always seems easier for niggas to jump on the bandwagon when it’s runnin’. if the lox and all these other niggas wouldnt have had their campaigns and whatnot, would g dep even be coming out? why he didn’t say shit when he first got signed? why are we just hearing about this in 2007?
^^^
Puff made him walk to africa for some cheesecake
February 18th, 2007 at 8:18 pm
>>jd only had kids as artist thats it
even if that were true, what’s that have to do with anything? how old you think Mase and The Lox were when they signed with Diddy?
anyway, you’re right, Puff is a stand up guy and everybody complaining is just mad they got jerked. When Shyne is finished with that 10 YEAR FUCKING BID he’s doing, he’ll probably sign with Bad Boy again.
February 18th, 2007 at 8:18 pm
D. Billz Says:
February 18th, 2007 at 8:15 pm
>>ok how come once these so called artist leave bad boy and free of “devil diddy†they never have the same success never
^Because Diddy is a BRAND. You’re gonna get more chicks in a Bentley than in a Honda Accord, but one an Accord is more practical to the average citizen than a Bentley. Can’t afford the gas, maintenance, or insurance. And that’s basically how Bad Boy is operated. Sure, you’ll definitely get the exposure you need. But, you’re assed out on everything else
112 went to def jam, thats a machine..what happened, faith went to sony (i think) and what happend..lox went to the major company interscope and has never been close to plat. again
February 18th, 2007 at 8:19 pm
j d only had kids as artist thats it, la reid did have beef with artist and baby face thats why laface split up they co owned it 2gether, andre harrell lost his label because he did not run it properly (uptown records) and then he ended up back working for his intern..diddy
^JD only had kids and they all did well. That beef with Reid and Face was over Toni Braxton (read: some ass). And though Andre didn’t run it properly I’ve NEVER heard of him havin’ as many disgruntled employees as Diddy. Loud Records wasn’t run properly either which led to their demise. Yet, Ruffin gave Wu-Tang the best group deal EVER which is still unmatched by today’s music industry standards.
February 18th, 2007 at 8:20 pm
>>let u tell it, each artist went plat.
……
February 18th, 2007 at 8:21 pm
February 18th, 2007 at 8:18 pm
>>jd only had kids as artist thats it
even if that were true, what’s that have to do with anything? how old you think Mase and The Lox were when they signed with Diddy?
anyway, you’re right, Puff is a stand up guy and everybody complaining is just mad they got jerked. When Shyne is finished with that 10 YEAR FUCKING BID he’s doing, he’ll probably sign with Bad Boy again.
bullshit aside shyne has one of the best deals in the recording industry, he owns all his publishing and had an option on his masters….and its no one fault shynes OWN lawyer admitted he busted a gun in open court, thats true documents, diddy lawyers never once brought up the fact shyne had a gun…stop listening to nas……”i dont like how diddy did shyne with different lawyers”
February 18th, 2007 at 8:21 pm
clarance thomas Says:
February 18th, 2007 at 8:18 pm
D. Billz Says:
February 18th, 2007 at 8:15 pm
>>ok how come once these so called artist leave bad boy and free of “devil diddy†they never have the same success never
^Because Diddy is a BRAND. You’re gonna get more chicks in a Bentley than in a Honda Accord, but one an Accord is more practical to the average citizen than a Bentley. Can’t afford the gas, maintenance, or insurance. And that’s basically how Bad Boy is operated. Sure, you’ll definitely get the exposure you need. But, you’re assed out on everything else
112 went to def jam, thats a machine..what happened, faith went to sony (i think) and what happend..lox went to the major company interscope and has never been close to plat. again
^You just proved my point, guy. You think you’re gonna get as much attention in a Honda than a Bentley? It has nothin’ to do with the quality of their music but of the popularity of the label. But just because the label is popular doesn’t mean it’s the most practical choice which led to my Honda/Bentley comparison.
February 18th, 2007 at 8:23 pm
bullshit aside shyne has one of the best deals in the recording industry, he owns all his publishing and had an option on his masters….and its no one fault shynes OWN lawyer admitted he busted a gun in open court, thats true documents, diddy lawyers never once brought up the fact shyne had a gun…stop listening to nas……â€i dont like how diddy did shyne with different lawyersâ€
^Court case aside, he was only given that deal because Puff didn’t want him as a priority anymore. Why? Because of the failing industry in general. He figures, “hey, by the time Shyne get out he’s gonna be no more good to me”, and probably the reason why the LOX got their publishing. You think he give a fuck about Shyne? I could care less who shot who that night, but litigations aside, if Puff can’t get a dollar off you than you’re no good.
February 18th, 2007 at 8:24 pm
if you aren’t smart enough to find a good lawyer by now…you’re lost…all these rap crews need to encourage at least one of their guys to do well enough academically to make it through law school…seriously…imagine if all the deadweight rappers in crews were their lawyers instead…the juice crew would have been better off with Biz Markie Esquire…lol
February 18th, 2007 at 8:24 pm
D. Billz Says:
February 18th, 2007 at 8:19 pm
j d only had kids as artist thats it, la reid did have beef with artist and baby face thats why laface split up they co owned it 2gether, andre harrell lost his label because he did not run it properly (uptown records) and then he ended up back working for his intern..diddy
^JD only had kids and they all did well. That beef with Reid and Face was over Toni Braxton (read: some ass). And though Andre didn’t run it properly I’ve NEVER heard of him havin’ as many disgruntled employees as Diddy.
but what u fell to understand is that none of these labels had as many indiv. plat. artist on an label ran by some1 there age black and they could identify with. they saw diddy with the bentleys and making forbes list and felt they should have been entilitied to i also, but thats like u as an employee thinking u should have the same things as ur ceo where u work. People get confused in the hip hop image, like its some family shit. This is what it boils down to diddy is the ceo and every1 else is employees nothing more nothing less
February 18th, 2007 at 8:27 pm
the same argument goes to when the ceo of bet sold the company to viacom and people said he sold out, it proves who never atteneded a college course in business or management, the goal is to start a company raise value then sell it for a huge profit and move on thats it nothing more or less…….c motown
^If you do the knowledge, most execs had quit college before they even could finish Gen Eds i.e. Puff.
February 18th, 2007 at 8:27 pm
D. Billz Says:
February 18th, 2007 at 8:23 pm
bullshit aside shyne has one of the best deals in the recording industry, he owns all his publishing and had an option on his masters….and its no one fault shynes OWN lawyer admitted he busted a gun in open court, thats true documents, diddy lawyers never once brought up the fact shyne had a gun…stop listening to nas……â€i dont like how diddy did shyne with different lawyersâ€
^Court case aside, he was only given that deal because Puff didn’t want him as a priority anymore.
^^^^^^^^^
shyne got that deal before he ever signed to diddy, one of the reasons is bcause there was a bidding war for him between def jam and other labels and he had a strong lawyer and business game….but most of these dumb ass mcs rap about making mills in the dope game before coming to rap and sign there life away for a 3 year legal pharmacy salary
February 18th, 2007 at 8:30 pm
but what u fell to understand is that none of these labels had as many indiv. plat. artist on an label ran by some1 there age black and they could identify with. they saw diddy with the bentleys and making forbes list and felt they should have been entilitied to i also, but thats like u as an employee thinking u should have the same things as ur ceo where u work. People get confused in the hip hop image, like its some family shit. This is what it boils down to diddy is the ceo and every1 else is employees nothing more nothing less
^Who said they felt they should be entitled to what Diddy has? Diddy uses his star power to make money off of unsuspecting people. Clive Davis has NO star power yet I’ve rarely heard a complaint from J Records (minus Busta). And Clive’s bank accout is at LEAST doubled Diddy’s.
February 18th, 2007 at 8:31 pm
shyne got that deal before he ever signed to diddy, one of the reasons is bcause there was a bidding war for him between def jam and other labels and he had a strong lawyer and business game….but most of these dumb ass mcs rap about making mills in the dope game before coming to rap and sign there life away for a 3 year legal pharmacy salary
^But if that’s the point you’re making, then Shyne’s situation is irrelevant. That has to do more with his court case, more of which I don’t care about.
February 18th, 2007 at 8:36 pm
Besides… all of these artists we’re naming are pre-Making the Band days. Tell me one artist in the last three years that’s been worth listening to that talked about signing to Bad Boy? You’re tryin’ to tell me that all these muhfuckas who’ve popped up in the last 3 years or so don’t want to be with the “unstoppable” Diddy?
February 18th, 2007 at 8:36 pm
With all this said Iceberg, question:
Would YOU sign to Diddy?
February 18th, 2007 at 8:38 pm
D. Billz Says:
February 18th, 2007 at 8:27 pm
the same argument goes to when the ceo of bet sold the company to viacom and people said he sold out, it proves who never atteneded a college course in business or management, the goal is to start a company raise value then sell it for a huge profit and move on thats it nothing more or less…….c motown
^If you do the knowledge, most execs had quit college before they even could finish Gen Eds i.e. Puff.
yep but they attended, dont believe the hype most ceos and top business people attended some type of formal education and puffs interning was higher education…there is no replacing education from wharton harvard mit or yale, there are a small few who make it with out, but many more who make it with it
February 18th, 2007 at 8:40 pm
“I wise man told me don’t argue with fools…”
nation, you didn’t send me that Grafh shit, fall back.
February 18th, 2007 at 8:40 pm
D. Billz Says:
February 18th, 2007 at 8:36 pm
With all this said Iceberg, question:
Would YOU sign to Diddy?
yes but not as an artist and my contract would be similar to an athelete, i would have an opt out deal and it would be more of an block deal, where they are distrubition and not an direct artist
February 18th, 2007 at 8:41 pm
yep but they attended, dont believe the hype most ceos and top business people attended some type of formal education and puffs interning was higher education…there is no replacing education from wharton harvard mit or yale, there are a small few who make it with out, but many more who make it with it
^Are you serious? The richest people in the world were/are drhug dealers, slave owners, and thieves which existed long before Ivy League. College teaches you to be a worker, not a boss. If that wasn’t the case, then the professors would be rich.
February 18th, 2007 at 8:43 pm
>>“I wise man told me don’t argue with fools…â€
^”I see, I said”
>>nation, you didn’t send me that Grafh shit, fall back.
^It thumps too.
February 18th, 2007 at 8:44 pm
yes but not as an artist and my contract would be similar to an athelete, i would have an opt out deal and it would be more of an block deal, where they are distrubition and not an direct artist
^I hope you got a lawyer after Diddy hears that and dies… laughing.
February 18th, 2007 at 8:58 pm
Grafh > Pap
February 18th, 2007 at 9:00 pm
Puff contracts may not be the most artist friendly, but we all know you have to grind and look out for yourself as well. Most of those artist on Bad Boyrelied too heavily on Puff and the company to do everything to keep them relevant. You have to hustle for yourself, promote yourself and not depend on the company to do everything.
February 18th, 2007 at 9:04 pm
Sai > Pap > Grafh
pap and grafh are mighty close though.
February 18th, 2007 at 9:05 pm
I don’t think most of those guys were thinking about it like 350k/10=35k a year, I think they was looking at it more like yo I’m gone take this money and I got the head dude in my corner so I’m gone drop heat each year and be good… Instead they signed with a guy that just wanted to stack contracks and steal publishing and never release dudes and thats what it comes down to….
February 18th, 2007 at 9:09 pm
es, what’s good with that iTunes alternative?
February 18th, 2007 at 9:13 pm
Sai > Pap > Grafh
pap and grafh are mighty close though.
^”oh no, oh, oh noooo” (c) Skateboard P./Nore
Grafh’s dedication to Sean Bell was iller, imo.
Lyrically… Grafh > Pap > Sai
Topics… Sai > Pap > Grafh
February 18th, 2007 at 9:13 pm
Diddy is a parasite but artists gotta step their games up. Get better lawyers and become more educated in the legal system.
February 18th, 2007 at 9:15 pm
what do you expect from a former major label a&r slimeball? that he CARES about hip hop and the people involved in it? fuck outta here. that nigga milked biggie’s death for all it was worth and then some, he’s got no respect for anything but the paper.
*oh shit* another gasface victim.
February 18th, 2007 at 9:21 pm
Saigon > Pap,Grafh,J-Hood, and most other east coast mixtape rappers
February 18th, 2007 at 9:23 pm
“Lyrically… Grafh > Pap > Sai
Topics… Sai > Pap > Grafh ”
let’s just hope any of the 3 drop an album this year.
February 18th, 2007 at 9:26 pm
Saigon better quit flexing on tv all the time though. He’s too caught up in weight lifting. His next video is probably gonna have DJ Sickamore and Just Blaze rubbing oils on a shirtless Saigon.(No Bavetta Barkley kiss)
but hopefully he releases his album soon.
February 18th, 2007 at 9:26 pm
E AKA THE REAL NORIEAGA Says:
February 18th, 2007 at 9:21 pm
Saigon > Pap,Grafh,J-Hood, and most other east coast mixtape rappers
^Fair assessment.
Sour D. Says:
February 18th, 2007 at 9:23 pm
“Lyrically… Grafh > Pap > Sai
Topics… Sai > Pap > Grafh â€
let’s just hope any of the 3 drop an album this year.
^Ditto.
February 18th, 2007 at 9:29 pm
>> nation, you didn’t send me that Grafh shit, fall back.
yerr, but when i do send you shit you get all hellen keller. this time i went straight to the comments section. forget what i just sent you though.
February 18th, 2007 at 9:36 pm
“capitalism has a way of exploiting the ignorant”
Or capitalism has a way of rewarding the competent.
February 18th, 2007 at 9:37 pm
I have pity on anyone that signs to Bad Boy and that snitch nigga P Diddy. I mean artists most be really fucking stupid to get into contracts like this. 350,000 for 7 albums? hah, damn.
February 18th, 2007 at 9:45 pm
Cut In Front Says: !!!!!!!!!!!
February 18th, 2007 at 9:47 pm
>> 350,000 for 7 albums
he woulda done 6, but that’s the number of the devil (whiteman). plus you can divide 350,000 by 7. 6… nat so mach (c) borat
February 18th, 2007 at 9:55 pm
lol at nations post
February 18th, 2007 at 9:56 pm
any of yall watching the all star game? Cant help but find that shit boring compared to last , and other years. Plus the dunk contest was garbage yesterday.
February 18th, 2007 at 9:59 pm
Christina A. can get it
February 18th, 2007 at 9:59 pm
**88 walks into room, Stone Drink…pisses in corner**
Dolemite > Puff Daddy
February 18th, 2007 at 10:00 pm
>> any of yall watching the all star game? Cant help but find that shit boring compared to last , and other years. Plus the dunk contest was garbage yesterday.
it’s not what it was. now it’s just all a huge ad placement, whether it’s advertising for other brands, advertising the NBA name or hyping up the player’s to divine status so little kids run out and buy the jerseys and sell their souls to teams. fuck it got me so pissed off that they had to put every fucking lame skill competition (which doesn’t prove shit) before the 3 pointer competition and especially the dunk competition. of course they will put it at the end, that’s what everyone watches it for, and they would lose ratings, but i find it weak that it has to be like that. people are forcing themselves to watch this crap, and sit through 3 minute ads. smh @ watching tv. lebron put no effort whatsoever in the skills comp last night, he knows it’s useless
February 18th, 2007 at 10:21 pm
nation Says:
February 18th, 2007 at 10:00 pm
>> any of yall watching the all star game? Cant help but find that shit boring compared to last , and other years. Plus the dunk contest was garbage yesterday.
it’s not what it was. now it’s just all a huge ad placement, whether it’s advertising for other brands, advertising the NBA name or hyping up the player’s to divine status so little kids run out and buy the jerseys and sell their souls to teams. fuck it got me so pissed off that they had to put every fucking lame skill competition (which doesn’t prove shit) before the 3 pointer competition and especially the dunk competition. of course they will put it at the end, that’s what everyone watches it for, and they would lose ratings, but i find it weak that it has to be like that. people are forcing themselves to watch this crap, and sit through 3 minute ads. smh @ watching tv. lebron put no effort whatsoever in the skills comp last night, he knows it’s useless
^^
Naw, no NBA game, too many wack niggas tryin to be cool… too many niggas throwin sucka punches & no niggas thrown straight jabs, No Bo’Los, just sucka corny shit…
February 18th, 2007 at 10:22 pm
E AKA THE REAL NORIEAGA Says:
February 18th, 2007 at 9:59 pm
Christina A. can get it
^^
YEa! Where that bitch @?
February 18th, 2007 at 10:25 pm
YEa! Where that bitch @?
^^^^
Halftime performance
February 18th, 2007 at 10:31 pm
naw that nigga is a snake thats why he cant get any new talent…..he has to do that making the band bullshyt because no one will sign those shady deals he tries to hand niggas………how can u talk that shyt about making other people rich and wishing others the best when u fucking them at the same time…..its no accident all of his artist left him
February 18th, 2007 at 10:35 pm
Diddy lost out on signing Jeezy to a solo deal and The Game. They were both close to signing but changed their minds.
February 18th, 2007 at 10:40 pm
add the gambling factor to my rant about the NBA’s fakeness
February 18th, 2007 at 10:45 pm
they should at least put an incentive into the all-star game to make it worth it for the players to put in at least a lil effort. like have the winning coast have home court advantage in the finals like baseball does it. the greatest dunk contest we’ll never see: kobe, vince, and tracy. i thought the most entertaining thing of the entire nite was shaq busting a move
February 18th, 2007 at 10:48 pm
i love how david stern forced the top stars into the bullshit “skills” challenge but is too pussy to put his top stars in the dunk contest. he should force them into the dunk contest
February 18th, 2007 at 10:52 pm
homerun derby > all star game
At least Bonds and Pujols can man up and challenge each other….. LeBron, Kobe, and Wade on the other hand are weak
February 18th, 2007 at 11:02 pm
350K upfront to rap, sounds pretty good to me! The problem is that rappers get that check and start the usual buying of bling, bitches, and butter and before you know it - Boom, back to the ghetto!
You can’t blame Puff, he gave the lil jit an opportunity to make it in hip-hop. He justed wasn’t hot enough.
February 18th, 2007 at 11:17 pm
that grafh and prinz is hardd
February 18th, 2007 at 11:24 pm
And 1 mixtape game> 07 NBA all star game
By a far margin might i add, this shit was garbage. No difference from any other season game. The all star games have changed alot. back in the day you had Dr J, Bird, then jordan all making the all star game an event you wouldnt want to miss. The shit was decent up to like 3 years back. Like nation said this weekend is just good for product placement and advertisements. You got Sony promoting they shit for the skills challenge, running back they video game commercials every second and giving players PS3’s as prizes. The skills challenge is dumb as hell, no effort involved in running drills elemntary kids do in practice.
The dunk contest aint been fire since carter won back in like 2000 or something.
Is it me or is everything on a decline. The NBA All star weekend/playoffs, Hip Hop, etc.
oh yeah, regardless of what people say i think kobe the best player in the nba now. U could see the animosity from the other players when he got that mvp. Maybe if them niggas played today like he did instead of treating that shit like a practice they’d have got the mvp.
February 18th, 2007 at 11:29 pm
Is it me or is everything on a decline. The NBA All star weekend/playoffs, Hip Hop, etc.
^^^^^
Baseball is on the upswing: Pujols, Reyes, Howard, Cabrerra, Santana, Liriano
February 18th, 2007 at 11:51 pm
PUFF IS DOING HIS JOB VERY WELL…BUT HE IS GETTING AT THESE DUDES HARD…HARD ENOUGH FOR THEM TO HUSTLE HARD. I BET YUNG JOC DON’T FUCK UP. AND 8BALL AND MJG ARE JUST NOW GETTING BACK INTO THE GAME…THEM NIGGAS BETTER SELL THAT CRACK (ALBUMS)
February 19th, 2007 at 12:21 am
This is tuff….Puffy should look out, in a sense. Puffy is (or should be) different from, let’s say, the guy who owns Virgin Records…who probably has never met any of his artists.
Artists sign these contracts cause they are not thinking that it will take the label 10 years to put out 5 albums (at this rate it will take Bad Boy 15 years!)….
Personally, my advice is not to sign long contracts. 3 albums at the most..and I still would want the possibility to not continue with the business relationship if I’m not treated properly. I would do something like 3 albums, but on a 1+1+1 basis. We do one and if everything is cool, we do the second one and the same for the third….
February 19th, 2007 at 12:46 am
weezy f baby
weezy frenches baby
February 19th, 2007 at 2:05 am
Game got punked in Vegas by Buck…haha…
February 19th, 2007 at 2:15 am
^ of course he did. you know who took a loss this weekend though?
http://www.perezhilton.com/upload/2007/02/our_future_boyfriend/kelisnewhair.jpg
February 19th, 2007 at 3:32 am
“Is it me or is everything on a decline. The NBA All star weekend/playoffs, Hip Hop, etc.
^^^^^
Baseball is on the upswing: Pujols, Reyes, Howard, Cabrerra, Santana, Liriano”
Liriano isn’t even movin his arm, forget about swingin anythin on that boy. and i think u forgettin griffey in that list… yeeaaahhh boy! (still got love for The Kid)
February 19th, 2007 at 8:41 am
Two-Times Says:
February 19th, 2007 at 2:05 am
Game got punked in Vegas by Buck…haha…
LINK OR DIE (C) ESKAY
( AND DON’T GIVE ME NO BULLSHIT PICS OF GAME WALKING WITH HIS BOYS )
February 19th, 2007 at 9:16 am
^^^^^
ballerstatus.net/news/read/id/12453611/
Thats all ive heard about it
February 19th, 2007 at 9:23 am
I told niggas Baby juvenile (G.Green)was gonna win the slam dunk contest. Still smh @ tyrus comments
*Hands in late pass*
February 19th, 2007 at 9:31 am
U know what could of been cool, if Buck and Game settled it there and then and had a battle instead of the nonsense that went on. Are at least took it outside. Coz G-Unit Game Beef is boring
February 19th, 2007 at 9:33 am
What happen between buck & game????
February 19th, 2007 at 9:35 am
As the ole’ saying goes: There’s a sucka born every minute!
Puffy has been known as a money leech for many years now, so anyone that signs with him should know everything about their situation with the company before doing so! If the hunger of getting a deal is more important than reading the fine print, then so be it! The price for fame can be a bytch sometimes, but everyone has a choice.
Puffy + Morals = It’ll Never Happen!
February 19th, 2007 at 9:44 am
There’s a link a couple comments up, there were at the same party in ?Vegas, nearly got into something but security squashed it.
February 19th, 2007 at 9:56 am
Sh*t Son Says:
February 19th, 2007 at 9:16 am
^^^^^
ballerstatus.net/news/read/id/12453611/
Thats all ive heard about it
GOOD LOOKS SOUNDS LIKE SOME BULLSHIT
HOW’S 2 TIMES SAY BUCK PUNKED GAME THER ? SOUNDS LIKE A BITCH MOVE TO ME ( BUT THAN AGAIN HE THINKS ITS OK TO MAKE A SONG CALLING SOMEONE A PUSSY AFTER YOU HAVE A RESTRAINING ORDER AGAINST THEM, EVEN IF THE JUDGE ORDERED IT YOU ANTAGONIZING THEM WHEN YOUR PROTECTED THATS A PUSSY MOVE. )
SO WHAT BUCK STARTS DISSING GAME WHEN HE IS FAR AS FUCK AWAY AND THERES A SEA OF PEOPLE AND SECURITY IN BETWEEN THEM AND THEN THEY WANNA CLAIM IT A VICTORY ?
THIS IS WHY I CAN’T RESPECT THESE DUDES AND BUCK WAS THE ONE I ACTUALLY RESPECTED, NOT TO MENTION HE LOSES EXTRA POINTS CAUSE I WAS JUST READING AN INTERVIEW WHERE HE WAS TALKING ABOUT HOW HE ISNT GONNA DISS CAM, DIPS JADA, FAT JOE OR THE GAME. HE WASN’T GONNA USE ANY OF THAT TO SELL HIS ALBUM AND WHATS THE FIRST THING HE DOESN WHEN HE GETS IN FRONT OF A CROWD OF PEOPLE ?
FUCK OUTTA HERE
ANOTHER BITCH MOVE BY THE UNIT
February 19th, 2007 at 10:02 am
does any1 know where i can watch the full episodes of american ganster past episodes on bet and no bet does not show the whole episodes
February 19th, 2007 at 10:04 am
it’s ok ty, we’ll fuck up(ayoo) two times when he gets here… juss calm down (c) you already know
February 19th, 2007 at 10:06 am
It doesnt sound like a bad deal to me.. 350,000 is the base salary not including extra money earned if your album sells the way Puff expected (which it obviously didnt)
That 350,000 is like a base salary then you have your bonuses for sales and shows, etc.. Any artist who signs just for the base salary alone is an idiot.
February 19th, 2007 at 10:08 am
clarance thomas Says:
February 19th, 2007 at 10:02 am
does any1 know where i can watch the full episodes of american ganster past episodes on bet?
February 19th, 2007 at 10:11 am
E-DUBBS Says:
February 19th, 2007 at 10:06 am
It doesnt sound like a bad deal to me.. 350,000 is the base salary not including extra money earned if your album sells the way Puff expected (which it obviously didnt)
That 350,000 is like a base salary then you have your bonuses for sales and shows, etc.. Any artist who signs just for the base salary alone is an idiot.
^^^^^^
$350,000 aint really that much after you factor in taxes lawyers managers and accountants he might have only seen maybe $100,000 of that money…and you gotta make that 350,000 back before you see any of your album sales
February 19th, 2007 at 10:15 am
350k is not alot, said from people, who probally made and average of less that 35k for the last ten years
February 19th, 2007 at 10:21 am
nation Says:
February 19th, 2007 at 10:04 am
it’s ok ty, we’ll fuck up(ayoo) two times when he gets here… juss calm down (c) you already know
LMAO
I JUST HAD TO GET IT OUT THE WAY EARLY I GOT MAD WORK TO DO TODAY WON’T BE ABLE TO KEEP WRITING NOVELS TODAY I’LL LEAVE BILLZ TO HIT CLEAN-UP TODAY, I’LL BE BY TO SEE WHAT FOOLS SAY AND SAY A QUICK PIECE HERE AND THERE BUT THATS ALL I GOT TIME FOR TODAY
February 19th, 2007 at 10:26 am
” I’M THE VOICE OF THE YOUTH THATS LIVIN FOR NO REASON/
FUCK RECORD SALES I GIVE THEM SOMETHING TO BELIEVE IN “
February 19th, 2007 at 10:50 am
Young Buck co-signs Wayne and Baby playing kissy face
WHO CARES
WHEN’S THAT LIVE FROM THE BRICKS DROPPING ?
February 19th, 2007 at 11:00 am
>> I JUST HAD TO GET IT OUT THE WAY EARLY I GOT MAD WORK TO DO TODAY WON’T BE ABLE TO KEEP WRITING NOVELS TODAY I’LL LEAVE BILLZ TO HIT CLEAN-UP TODAY, I’LL BE BY TO SEE WHAT FOOLS SAY AND SAY A QUICK PIECE HERE AND THERE BUT THATS ALL I GOT TIME FOR TODAY
you are APPRECIATD. can’t wait to hear from you again. kk, buh bye. lol
>> Young Buck co-signs Wayne and Baby playing kissy face
he done did it years ago, this article ain’t saying that… you know you done went hollywood when…
February 19th, 2007 at 11:06 am
“WHEN’S THAT LIVE FROM THE BRICKS DROPPING ? ”
Tommorow
February 19th, 2007 at 11:19 am
Sour D. Says:
February 19th, 2007 at 11:06 am
“WHEN’S THAT LIVE FROM THE BRICKS DROPPING ? â€
Tommorow
WORD
* E-SMACKS NATION’S E-KUFI *
February 19th, 2007 at 11:26 am
>>he done did it years ago, this article ain’t saying that… you know you done went hollywood when…
………..
*gets on nation Kufi line*
February 19th, 2007 at 11:28 am
eskay Says:
February 19th, 2007 at 11:26 am
>>he done did it years ago, this article ain’t saying that… you know you done went hollywood when…
………..
*gets on nation Kufi line*
LMAO
February 19th, 2007 at 11:35 am
350 isnt alot in terms of total earnings but that 350 just represents your bare minimum.. The real money is made off of successfull albums that you put out. Now if you tank, like he did.. its a wrap.. But lets be real, Puff not an idiot. He not gonna over-pay for some damn G-Dep. Giving G-Dep a deal of any sort is a gift in the first place.
February 19th, 2007 at 4:11 pm
I don’t think race has anything to do with this at all. This is nothing more than the art of negotiation.
G-Dep supposed to be a street nigga and he let someone hussle him this simple?
$350,000 for 5 albums; even if you drop 1 album a year (the most you could ever hope for), that’s only 75,000 a year. What… G-Dep don’t know mathematics?
You can’t blame Puff for this, it’s not a complex enough deal to say anybody got tricked; G-Dep just signed a bad deal. And it’s funny because I thought I remember there being some kinda bidding war for this kid.
He sold himself cheap, for way too long an agreement. THE PERSON HE NEEDS TO BE MAD AT IS HIS LAWYER!
February 19th, 2007 at 4:14 pm
…SORRY, I MEANT $70,000 A YEAR, EVEN WORSE!
February 19th, 2007 at 10:50 pm
Not saying it’s right but it’s true and it’s the “Amreican Way”.
February 20th, 2007 at 1:21 pm
eSKay,
you are on a gotdamned spaceship when you use moral responsibility and record exec in the same post.
how real is it that G-Dep had to sit in the clink because Diddy didn’t want to fork over $750 for dude’s bail? It’s like this… That $350,000 is gone, your azz is dead and stinking. Puff and giving niggas dough for a fucking bus pass.
speaking of spaceships… I like that Kangay West song called ‘Spaceship’ featuring GLC and Consequence a/k/a Dr. Teeth
February 20th, 2007 at 1:45 pm
Dude, a contract is a contract. Puff’s contract are no different than Sony’s or Universal’s. The effe’d up thing is that cats expect brothers to do business differently than the majors. Cam was right when he dissed Nas, taunting him to run up on Tommy Motolla and Donny Ienner at Sony. Jigs are still scared of White but have much ballz (nullus) when it comes to dealing with our own. Also, Bad Boy contracts HAVE to reflect the terms of their distributer (Arista/ BMG) so to have less in his contract would mean that Puff would be fucking himself up. What part of the game is this? Niggas don’t be beefing when they take out leases for cars and loans for colleges and mortgages unless Black runs the show, then they have a lot to say. All them niggas (LOX, G Dep, Shyne, Ma$e) is straight PUSS when it comes to business. Funny shit is these niggas had it waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaay better then all them cats signed to Death Row. Only a handful of niggas popped shit abour Suge, plus did so after dude fell way the eff off. Soft! This is coming from a seasoned entertainment lawyer that KNOWS the business.
February 20th, 2007 at 2:33 pm
^when CJ talks, I’ll listen.
as for the rest of you Community college dropouts….
February 20th, 2007 at 5:08 pm
I myself have been jerked around by Sean Combs as well. I was set to sign a contract w/ Bad Boy records around the same time as Gdep and elected not to. Most people thought I was crazy at the time, but something about it didn’t feel right. I had had some producers signed to the hitmen(puff’s production team) who actually did a track (I want the world to see) on Dep’s album and was never payed my a+r fees for. My producers (Hot Block) also did the lead track for the Madd Rapper album that I also found and was not paid for. At the time I didn’t know I was to be compensated, Sean verbally promised to take care of me and never did.
You would think somebody who comes from where you are from would understand how big these small amounts of monies are to someone who hasn’t achieved what he has.
February 20th, 2007 at 5:24 pm
Whaddup Es? Love to polly and build on some possibilities when u get the chance. Holla.
February 21st, 2007 at 5:23 pm
Ay man reading is fundamental yall remember that?? You learn that when you are in 1st grade.
Puff or whoever can do nothing but what’s in your contract? So b4 the lox, gdep, mase, etc. sign the dotted line, how bout take some time and read the dam document.
If you sign something you dont understand you deserve to get raped. Flat out
tell gdep and them to get thier comprehension skills up, fa real…
February 22nd, 2007 at 10:50 am
Diddy is the shepard and his artists are the sheep. It’s is the job of the shepard to get the maximum yield out of his flock. That means wool for clothes, milk, meat…EVERYTHING! It’s not the shepard’s fault. The fault lies with people lining up to be sheep.
Know your business or stay out of the game. It won’t change for you.
February 25th, 2007 at 11:29 pm
Honestly, it’s jus tha way Diddy be doin his business. The only person he ever really made successfull was Biggie, and thaz cuz biggie was a business man. He wasn’t some hustluh off tha block who wasnt really business oriented. Lil Cease talks about it in “The Chronicles of The Junior MAFIA”. He went to diddy tryina get money for a new album and diddy turned him away like he didnt even know his ass. Diddy’s a snake with fine-print schemes to fuck cats outta they loot plain and simple… Which basically just makes him an upper-class white business man. Kinda like a new york stock exchasnge type a cat.